Hello,It has been a pleasure for me to test Windows 7 so far, it is a wonderful OS.BUT I WILL NEVER BUY IT !I will never buy it indeed for as long as it comes with a build in IE : why ?- I have been a fervent addict to everything that comes from Microsoft since 1986.- The IE8 version that comes with Windows 7 made me however change my mind completely !!The IE8 version that comes with Windows 7 beta 7000 :- Freezes all the time- Stops responding all the time- Asks all the time whether I want to send information about the encountered problems to MS.I have had it :- I do accept that we have to work with a beta version of a total package (OS with build in IE amongst others) if the improvements of that IE component do not come to the beta-testers of the OS.If MS wants to keep it that way, then they have to bring us a version of Windows 7 WITHOUT IE8 !!- WhatI cannot accept any longer is that MS keeps silent when it comes to the problems with IE8 in Windows 7.- What I cannot accept any longer is that the beta-version of Windows 7 does not get the RC version of IE8 which is hopefully MUCH BETTERThis means that it looks like Windows 7 will be totally unusable for me (and many others) when it comes with IE8 !What a disaster ! Or should I say"How obstinate MS can be".

Stop posting the same post twice!!As i mentioned above, ITS A BETA! The version of IE8 in Windows 7 Build 7000 is OLDER than the current RC1 version available for Vista/XP, so its bound to be more buggy!!GET OVER YOURSELF!

When the Windows 7 RC is available it will include a newer version of IE8!

Picsoe said: This means that it looks like Windows 7 will be totally unusable for me (and many others) when it comes with IE8 !What a disaster ! Or should I say"How obstinate MS can be".To reject an entire operating system just because you don't rate the browser than comes with it is NUTS!!Putting aside the fact that W7's IE8 is still in beta, there are plenty of other browsers out there that you can use instead.Any REASONABLE person would say "it is a wondeful OS, but I don't like the browser, so I'm going to use FireFox/Safari/Opera/whatever with it instead."If it were a component for which there were no alternatives, I would agree with you. But it isn't.So don't be daft.

There must be something wrong with your machine or your installation as IE 8 is working fantastic for me. Not even a hiccup.

BBFC-UK said: Stop posting the same post twice!!As i mentioned above, ITS A BETA! The version of IE8 in Windows 7 Build 7000 is OLDER than the current RC1 version available for Vista/XP, so its bound to be more buggy!!GET OVER YOURSELF!I am sorry for this double posting.I did not mean to do so - it happened due to a freezing or not responding IE again (I did not know whether or not my first post was sent).For the rest of your answer : I know it is olderHence my request to make the newer version available like they did for all the other OS versions.This would probably stop - a lot a unneeded problem-feedback- a lot of people leaving IE (my only browser since 1994) and not intending to come back to IE- questions like : why are the FireFox betas working and not the IE versions

djwayne said: There must be something wrong with your machine or your installation as IE 8 is working fantastic for me. Not even a hiccup. I have made a clean install and everything is working fine.My opinion about Windows 7 = Wonderful, Splendid !But IE8 that came with it is really spoiling everything.I do not have any browsing problems with FireFox 3.0.5 or 3.0.6 and I hate this because I am an MS (and thus also an IE) lover since 1986 (Windows 3.0) and 1994 (IE).When I read on the internet, I can see a lot of people having a lot of problems wit IE8.And it looks even like these "freezing" and "not reponding" problems with IE started already with the latest updates ofIE7 under Windows Vista.I can imagine that there are problems, that a beta is not perfect yet.But in view of the above problems : MS should treat us (the MS lovers) as partners for bad and for worse, not as some neglectable "beta testers".

Thack said: Picsoe said: This means that it looks like Windows 7 will be totally unusable for me (and many others) when it comes with IE8 !What a disaster ! Or should I say"How obstinate MS can be".To reject an entire operating system just because you don't rate the browser than comes with it is NUTS!!Putting aside the fact that W7's IE8 is still in beta, there are plenty of other browsers out there that you can use instead.Any REASONABLE person would say "it is a wondeful OS, but I don't like the browser, so I'm going to use FireFox/Safari/Opera/whatever with it instead."If it were a component for which there were no alternatives, I would agree with you. But it isn't.So don't be daft. I made a resume of what you called me : nutsunreasonabledaftbeye now

[quote]- questions like : why are the FireFox betas working and not the IE versions[/quote]The version of IE8 in Windows 7 is DIFFERENT to the version available for Vista/XP, just as the version of IE7 in Vista is different to the version available to XP. There are many features and technologies exclusive to the version of IE8 on Windows 7 (for example, Protected Mode). I agree its still buggy, thats why I am using Firefox as my default browser, but a new version will included in the Windows 7 RC, and the Final Version will be lot more stable.The Firefox betas have nothing to do with it, Firefox is not a component of Windows 7.

You should not use the Beta version to form an opinion of the final product, thats what Betas are for, to eliminate bugs.

Picsoe said:djwayne said: There must be something wrong with your machine or your installation as IE 8 is working fantastic for me. Not even a hiccup. I have made a clean install and everything is working fine.My opinion about Windows 7 = Wonderful, Splendid !But IE8 that came with it is really spoiling everything.I do not have any browsing problems with FireFox 3.0.5 or 3.0.6 and I hate this because I am an MS (and thus also an IE) lover since 1986 (Windows 3.0) and 1994 (IE).When I read on the internet, I can see a lot of people having a lot of problems wit IE8.And it looks even like these "freezing" and "not reponding" problems with IE started already with the latest updates ofIE7 under Windows Vista.I can imagine that there are problems, that a beta is not perfect yet.But in view of the above problems : MS should treat us (the MS lovers) as partners for bad and for worse, not as some neglectable "beta testers".I'd like to recant my opinion of IE 8, I have had one problem with it. One of my favorite forums, (Ranger-Forums.com) doesn't work right with IE 8. Every time I go to a post, it blocks it with a white screen. It works fine with Firefox.

BBFC-UK said: [quote]- questions like : why are the FireFox betas working and not the IE versions[/quote]The Firefox betas have nothing to do with it, Firefox is not a component of Windows 7.Then MS should stop making IE part of the OS.In this way the problems with IE would not cripple the beauty of the OS (even in beta).Once again : I am an overall MS lover and I never had objections againstthe integration of IE into the OS.But now that MS is keeping silent about this IE problem and the way/when they are going to solve it made me change my mind about the integration of IE into the OS.Beta testers should be treated as partners, not as some nasty geeks.Anyway :MS stopped integrating products like Messenger, Mail, Photo Gallery, etc ...They made it available as "Live" products.They might as well do it with IE.In that case the wonderful Win7 OS would not suffer unnecessarely from the IEproblems.And if they want to continue with the integration into the OS, then they have to accept the consequences and the complaints about the overall OS of which it became a unseparable part.Do a Google search about : IE stopped respondingAnd then do the same search with Live SearchIt will be obvious that MS is ignoring the problem.

Picsoe said: And if they want to continue with the integration into the OS, then they have to accept the consequences and the complaints about the overall OS of which it became a unseparable part. "Unseparable " is irrelevant.My argument remains: if you don't like IE8 in W7, nobody is forcing you to use it. You can remove it from your start menu, replace it with FireFox or whatever, and never have to even think about IE8 again.What's the problem? Seriously, where is the problem with that?(Yes, I hope IE8 is faster and less buggy when W7 is launched, but NO WAY would it become a reason to reject the whole OS. There is simply no logic to that argument.)

Thack said: "Unseparable " is irrelevant.I'd like to see a solid explanation about this by MS (not yourself - please do not reply).-It looks like you do not read posts completely before to answer them !- I think that what you like most is to read your own answers, even without reading the other people's posts :-)

Thack said: My argument remains: if you don't like IE8 in W7, nobody is forcing you to use it. You can remove it from your start menu, replace it with FireFox or whatever, and never have to even think about IE8 again.It will remain on my systemIt will remain in my registryBut once again - and maybe you will read it some day ( I do not believe in it anymore)I am an overall MS lover and I never had objections againstthe integration of IE into the OS.But now that MS is keeping silent about this IE problem and the way/when they are going to solve it made me change my mind about the integration of IE into the OS.Beta testers should be treated as partners, not as some nasty geeks.Do a Google search about : IE stopped respondingAnd then do the same search with Live SearchIt will be obvious that MS is ignoring the problem.And what are you doing ?You treat everybody who do not share your opinion as stupid morons.LIKEWISEPlease keep out of the discussion that I started - you have been of NO HELP so far - on the contrary.I will not reply to your answers/posts anymore unless I can recognise that you have SERIOUSLY read ALL OF MY POSTS AND ANSWERS COMPLETELY (and that you understand them :-)).

Thack said: but NO WAY would it become a reason to reject the whole OS. Watch the decision of the Eurpean Commission.And I might fully support them this time !

This thread is closed as far as I am concerned.I will not read any more answers or insults.I will not give any more answers neither.I have enough information :- to continue doing my job- to take the necessary mesures where neededbeye

Picsoe said: Please keep out of the discussion that I started - you have been of NO HELP so far - on the contrary. Listen, mate, you're the one who said:"BUT I WILL NEVER BUY IT ! Iwill never buy it indeed for as long as it comes with a build in IE"...and....."This means that it looks like Windows 7 will be totally unusable for me (and many others) when it comes with IE8."And no matter how much you squirm, the simple fact remains that your position is TOTALLY ILLOGICAL. Are you SERIOUSLYclaiming that the whole of the Windows 7 operating system will be "totally unusable" because of the bugs in IE8? REALLY???Why don't you admit that you expressed yourself badly, and that you MEANT to say "IE8 will be totally unusable", NOT "Windows 7 will be totally unusable". Indeed, you may find a large number of people would agree with that sentiment!But expecting Microsoft to do a special build of W7 without IE8 is living in a dreamworld.

Picsoe said: This thread is closed as far as I am concerned.I will not read any more answers or insults.I will not give any more answers neither.Ah, so he throws his teddy out of the pram. Very mature, that. I expect you're proud of yourself.

Where do you start with this?cutting of your nose to spite your face ring any bells to you ?a wonderful operating system, but you wont buy it because internet explorer 8 freezes. have you thought this out at all, because if you had i think you may not have written this post. i mean that with the greatest respect, i am not having a go.everything about this operating system is great in your opinion, except one thing, and you will willing overlook all the positives for one negative, which will be fixed by the time 7 ships.can you not just use another browser for now, im using firefox for now, and it works flawlessly

jonmac69 said: cutting of your nose to spite your face ring any bells to you ?This kind of affronting remarks will not make me change my mind - on the contrary.Come up with solutions to the problem instead.

I find IE 8.0 beta both in Windows 7 and Windows Vista/XP rather buggy; however, it is only a 'beta' copy. Bu the time the final version of IE 8.0 is released many of the most troublesome bugs will have been eradicated. It is impossible to say 'all' bugs will have disappeared because what is an annoyance to one person is nothing but a slight inconvience to another and Microsoft will only fix the bugs that are the most prevalent.If you think about it IE 6.0 and IE 7.0 were exactly the same 'until' the final release when they turned out to be far better than previous versions. I am not overwhelmed with Windows 7 but I cannot dismiss it completely because of its beta status. The time to say 'yes' i will use it is when it is finally released, then you can see exactly what it has to offer. Beta software is 'software in progress' nothing is set in stone until the final release, IE 8.0 is no exception.John Barnett - Windows XP Associate Expert; Windows Desktop Experience. - Web: http://www.winuser.co.uk; Web: http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org; Web: http://vistasupport.mvps.org

firstly - im surprised you responded given that you said the thread was dead to you.secondly - i think you are cutting of your nose to spite your face, and i pointed out that i wasn't having a go at you.thirdly (solutions to the problem)- use firefox/opera/safari/chrome for now, as i stated in my earlier post.now that you have had time to think this over, have you considered the possibility that you are being pedantic over an issue, that when all is said and done, isn't that important right now. there are alternatives, and till such time as you are able to use a stable IE8, surely you can use an alternative browser.

He is making assumptions about a product based on a BETA version of it - that is not logical!!!The version of IE7 in Vista is COMPLETELY different to the version you can download for Windows XP. IE7 on Vista has exclusive features only available on a Vista-machine, for example, Protected Mode. Its tied into the OS and utilisies a lot of the new secuirty enhancements of Vista, the same can be said about IE8 on Windows 7.

Picsoe, as far as I know, the EU is trying to force MS to remove its Internet Browser from all versions released in europe. They are going the same path as WMP, as they reckon it stifles competition.

I guess I better start using IE8 in my Windows 7 more. I haven't seen any problems with it.In fact, I like it better than IE7 since it brought my Links Bar back (as the Favorites Bar). I just could not get my Links Bar to be persistant in IE7 under Vista or Server 2008.I like IE8 so much, I am going to install it on at least one of my Vista or Server 2008 machines.