Can HDMI be routed over IP/IPv6, or dare I say it, transported over HTTP? Since HDMI is a digital protocol, this must be possible. Is there any known work in progress to get HDMI to be routed over IP/IPv6, or even to get it to be transported over HTTP? Do these CE hardware folks even know about the Internet? And why can't they fit PC video cards with real HDMI connectors that can carry HD audio as well? All PC video cards I've seen have S-Video out, or a DVI-HDMI adapter, and neither can carry audio. With a high-bandwidth Layer 2 technology such as 10Gbps Ethernet or InfiniBand that offers even more bandwidth, the commodity potential of HDMI over IPv6 would be enormous. It can drive a substantial segment of any nation's economy. Thanks.

??????HDMI is an audio/video connection standard; IPv6 is a networking standard. They have absolutely nothing in common with each other, other that that, yes, they're both digital info (albeit in different languages.)HTTP is a specific internet protocol. Again, zero in common with HDMI.There are videocards that do audio over HDMI:most nVidia 8600 series and higher can do it; however, it's 1- cludgey (requires an internal audio cable), and 2- is up to the individual card manufacturer to implement it or not.ATI's HD 3xxx and HD 4xxx cards support audio over HDMI, without any kludgery: there's an onboard audio chip.Most of these cards also have a proper HDMI port on them. Yes, some do use a DVI-HDMI adapter; but, they do still pass audio thru the adapter.HTH,Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

What would you say about technologies like InfiniBand over Ethernet? Both are Layer 2 technologies.Or, how about simple virtualization technologies like Hyper-V and ESXi that provide IP communication capability over emulated Ethernet purely in software?DVI-HDMI adapters cannot carry audio data that's part of HDMI,audiowould require a separate connection.Please see the FAQs at:http://www.hdmi.org/I have yet to see PC video cards that have a real HDMI connector. Could you please be more specific? There are three types of HDMI connectors, which type is available with the video cards that you've mentioned?Thanks.

I have yet to see PC video cards that have a real HDMI connector. Could you please be more specific? There are three types of HDMI connectors, which type is available with the video cards that you've mentioned?Now you can see them: link SPEnthusiast said:DVI-HDMI adapters cannot carry audio data that's part of HDMI,audiowould require a separate connection.Please see the FAQs at:http://www.hdmi.org/That depends on the specific videocard, as well as the DVI-HDMI adapter (some adapters are so capable, others aren't.) However, the card itself needs to support it first.HDMI via adapter cardsAs said earlier, the ATI HD 3xxx and HD 4xxx cards all support it; HDMI audio (via DVI-HDMI adapter) for nVidia-based boards is up to the individual manufacturer. Some cards have an onboard SPDIF connector, some don't.ATI is more elegant in this respect, as their chip has an integrated audio processor. nVidia uses a passthru connection.Still don't believe? Read ATI's HD 3800 overview.As for InfiniBand: while, yes, the tech was initially intended to replace Ethernet (in addition to its primary role as a device interconnect for large servers and supercomputers), it hasn't yet happened (nor, IMHO, is that likely to happen.) One problem is that it doesn't 'speak' IEEE 802.3 (standard ethernet language) - in other words, it's proprietary.Ethernet is way, way too well entrenched to be replaced by anything (and, fiber doesn't count in this argument, as its an extention of theIEEE 802.3standard.) SPEnthusiast said:Or, how about simple virtualization technologies like Hyper-V and ESXi that provide IP communication capability over emulated Ethernet purely in software?I'm not going to comment on that, because, frankly, I can't see how it has any bearing on the original question (routing HDMI over IPv6 or HTTP.)-Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Well, which is it - SPDIF or real HDMI?SPDIF, evenoptical, doesn't havethe bandwidth to carry 7.1 channel HD audio as its only meant for 5.1 channel DVD quality audio. I don't even want todiscuss the virtually infinite capabilityfor audio channels in DTS-HD Master Audio, since that would be kicking you in the shin. To sum thisup, SPDIF can't carry 7.1 channel audio available through Dolby TrueHD. DTS-HD Master Audio has been artificially limited to 7.1 channels in Blu-ray.Let'sbe clear about one thing, once you plug a DVI-HDMI adapter into a DVI jack, you can't get audio of any kind out. Please see the FAQs at:http://www.hdmi.org/The DVI jack can't output audio, and PC video cards only have a DVI jack, I've never seen an HDMI jack on any PC video cards. If there is a PC video card with an HDMI jack, I would like to know about it.IfEthernet can be emulated by Hyper-V, ESXi, etc., HDMI can be emulated in software as well. The premise is that both are digital technologies.P.S.If everything that can be invented has been invented, we wouldn't have crime, poverty, disease, etc., and in general, we wouldn't have misery.We seem to be taking steps backwards though, as some people are losing shelter.

SPEnthusiast said:Let'sbe clear about one thing, once you plug a DVI-HDMI adapter into a DVI jack, you can't get audio of any kind out. Please see the FAQs at:http://www.hdmi.org/The DVI jack can't output audio, and PC video cards only have a DVI jack, I've never seen an HDMI jack on any PC video cards. If there is a PC video card with an HDMI jack, I would like to know about it.Answered the first time; and, posted links to the cards that you claim don't exist the second time.Not going to repeat that - I'd respectfully suggest that you take a look at the pretty pictures.And, you are correct in one thing: a DVI jack, by itself (such as the DVI connection on my AIW 9800Pro) can't output audio thru a DVI-HDMI adapter. However, a videocard that has an onboard sound processor (as the ATI HD 3xxx and HD 4xxx cards) CAN, when used with its adapter. Also, the aforementioned nVidia-based boards CAN do audio passthru - thru the DVI port! - , so long as the board manufacturer chose to implement it. SPEnthusiast said: Well, which is it - SPDIF or real HDMI?SPDIF, evenoptical, doesn't havethe bandwidth to carry 7.1 channel HD audio as its only meant for 5.1 channel DVD quality audio. I don't even want todiscuss the virtually infinite capabilityfor audio channels in DTS-HD Master Audio, since that would be kicking you in the shin. To sum thisup, SPDIF can't carry 7.1 channel audio available through Dolby TrueHD. DTS-HD Master Audio has been artificially limited to 7.1 channels in Blu-ray.SPDIF does carry (among other things) D5.1 audio, and in the same format (because , from a DVD, it's a raw bitstream) as an HDMI cable does.As for SPDIF not having the bandwidth to carry 7.1 audio: so don't use an nVidia-based videocard. Go with ATI - native, on-chip support for 7.1 audioYou seem to be stuck on this statement (quoted directly from hdmi.org):Q. Do I need a separate audio cable if my if my HDMI output is a physical DVI (DVI to HDMI adapter) port is not a true HDMI port?Digital Visual Interface (DVI) is a video interface standard designed to maximize the visual quality of digital display devices such as flat panel LCD computer displays and digital projectors. Because DVI is a video-only standard, a graphics card with DVI port, even one with a DVI-HDMI adapter sends uncompressed digital video data to a display but does not send audio.That applies to cards that do not support audio over a DVI-HDMI adapter, such as my aforementioned 9800 Pro. A card that supports SPDIF passthru (even if it's only 5.1), or a card that has an onboard audio processor (and, therefore, can send the full audio signal to the DVI port) is not covered by the above blanket statement by hdmi.org. SPEnthusiast said:IfEthernet can be emulated by Hyper-V, ESXi, etc., HDMI can be emulated in software as well. The premise is that both are digital technologies.I fail to see the point. DVI is a digital technology; CD audio is a digital technology; DVD is a digital technology (actually, several technologies); everything found in a PC is a digital technology.I just can't wrap my head around why you seem to see the 'need' to transmit an HDMI signal using an Ethernet standard - they're wildly different standards.IF, however,the question is "can I use Cat5e (ethernet) cable in place of an HDMI cable": if your soldering skills are good enough, then, I suppose you could. Twisted-pair is quite interference resistant.Hyper-V (as well as other machine virtualization methods)'s networking emulation is there to allow the virtual machine to talk to the underlying hardware (and, by extention, to the network itself.) However, it still relies on the basic ethernet standards - there's no translation from, say, Latin to German that's going on. ;)Just my $0.02,Chris [If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

I can't look at those pictures since I can't trust your links.There's this distinction that you don't seem to understand: I've seen product Web pages onwww.ati.com that claim capabilities like DTS-HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD for their video cards, so I don't doubt that they have onboard capability for HD audio. But the problem is in getting audio out of those cards. You're still stuck with SPDIF, as you've stated right after quoting www.hdmi.org. SPDIF can't carry HD audio. Only HDMI has the capability for transmitting HD audio along with HD video. And that makes it a prime candidate for transmission over HTTP over IP/IPv6.I'll be making clear the requirements and advantages of transmitting HDMI over IP/IPv6 over Layer 2 technologies such as Ethernet, or better yet, InfiniBand, in a different thread. If you open your mind up a litttle, you would get it. Or perhaps you're just pretending that you haven't only to mislead others.

SPEnthusiast said: I can't look at those pictures since I can't trust your links.There's this distinction that you don't seem to understand: I've seen product Web pages onwww.ati.com that claim capabilities like DTS-HD Master Audio and Dolby TrueHD for their video cards, so I don't doubt that they have onboard capability for HD audio. But the problem is in getting audio out of those cards. You're still stuck with SPDIF, as you've stated right after quoting www.hdmi.org. SPDIF can't carry HD audio. Only HDMI has the capability for transmitting HD audio along with HD video. And that makes it a prime candidate for transmission over HTTP over IP/IPv6.I'll be making clear the requirements and advantages of transmitting HDMI over IP/IPv6 over Layer 2 technologies such as Ethernet, or better yet, InfiniBand, in a different thread. If you open your mind up a litttle, you would get it. Or perhaps you're just pretending that you haven't only to mislead others. Then either go to NewEgg.com and find the videocards yourself, or go away. And, ONLY THE NVIDIA CARDS ARE STUCK WITH THE KLUDGEY SPDIF PASSTHRU!!!!!!!!!!ATI, as you said, has an onboard audio solution.You, sir, need to open your mind a bit. You seem to have made up your mind as to what you wanted to hear; anything that doesn't agree with that is automatically wrong.I'm done here. Bye!-Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Well, I've seen pictures of those ATI video cards on some other retail sites, and they only have S-Video out and DVI out - neither of which can carry HD audio. Or perhaps you're misled by the DisplayPort jack on those cards.SPDIF can't carry HD audio, period. The fact that you would even consider SPDIF a solution, even a sloppy one, pointsyou out fortrying to mislead others reading this thread.There'sa void that needs to be filled in the PC audio space, and HDMIfills it. I guess PC soundcard manufacturers don't like that, and neither do PC video card manufacturers. So, there's a lot going against HDMI on the PC.Here's my solution:transport HDMI over HTTP over IPv6.Soon everything in the home will be hooked up to the IPv6 Internet and HDMI over HTTP over IPv6 will blend in just great.

You know what? I've thought about this here and there today, and, I decided that I wasn't quite done.Aside from IPv6 being a networking protocol, and HDMI being an audio/video protocol (therefore, why would you try to transmit protocol A using protocol B, when both are well-established standards); there's also an issue of bandwidth.Standard LANs are still running at 100Mb/s. Yes, Gigabit is coming into more widespread use; but, 10/100 is still the norm.HDMI has much, much higher bandwidth. HDMI 1.0 thru 1.2 has abandwidth specof 4.9Gb/s (typical continuous throughput is ~2.78Gb/s); HDMI has a bandwidth spec of 10.2Gb/s (typical continuous throughput of 5.56Gb/s for 1080p @ 60fps.)(above taken fromhttp://forums.highdefdigest.com/home-theater-gear/272-fiber-optic-vs-hdmi-v1-3-a.html)Honestly, I think that you have it backwards. HDMI would be better suited for networking, than a network would be for HDMI transmission.SPE, I never, never said that SPDIF could carry HD audio. Care to quote where you think that I did say that?Nor did I say that the ATI cards 'stuck one with SPDIF for audio.' They DO make cards that have real, honest-to-God HDMI ports. Don't believe me? Take a real, hard browse thru ATI's website. Here's a helpful link to get you going:http://ati.amd.com/products/Radeonhd3800/index.html(posted already, BTW.)Or, take a look at all of the videocards that are offered for sale at NewEgg.com (caution- long link):http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048+1320923120&Configurator=&Subcategory=48&description=&Ntk=&SpeTabStoreType=&srchInDesc= That's 40 cards; 32 of them in stock (as of 29 Dec 2008, 17:30EST.) :)Still don't want to click the link? Then search the site yourself. Shock and awe yourself (and me.)You say that I'm trying to 'mislead others reading this thread?' I say nay-nay. You're misleading yourself, by refusing to do a little research before you go spout off; then refusing to take a look at the information that someone is trying to show you.Take the blinders off there, buddy. :P-Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

HDMI in CE devices uses TMDS for networking/transport. Any Layer 2 technology can be used to transport HDMI, including Ethernet/InfiniBand running underneath IPv6. Like I've said, I'll be posting the requirements for and advantages of doing so in a different thread.Bandwidth at the rate of 10+Gbps in the home will become a non-issue soon in the future, especially when you throw in consumer electronics into the mix that would generate a mass market that would drive prices of InfiniBand products down.I've looked at the product Web page for ATI's HD3800 video card that you've mentioned, and they don't even claim HD audio capability for that card, let alone it having an HDMI port. I don't know which site you're looking at.Even if you don't mean anything bad, those sublevels in your links caninvoke a lot of code that can be malicious.

OK, I got my levels of ATI card a little jumbled - my bad.HD 3800 series: "Integrated Digital Outputs Enjoy your digital content the way you want to, with built-in HDMI that includes 5.1 surround audio for big screen entertainment."(fromhttp://ati.amd.com/products/radeonhd3800/index.html)HD 4600 series: "HDMI - Enjoy the latest audio technologies using HDMI with 7.1 digital surround sound support delivering 8-channel audio. Also, xvYCC support allows the user to enjoy a wider range of colors when connected to a capable HDTV. " (fromhttp://ati.amd.com/products/radeonhd4600/index.html)HD 4800 series: "HDMI - Enjoy the latest audio technologies using HDMI with 7.1 digital surround sound support. Also, xvYCC support allows the user to enjoy a wider range of color when connected to a capable HDTV."(fromhttp://ati.amd.com/products/radeonhd4800/index.html)That's three (3) times that I see HDMI mentioned. And, there's this: (again, for the HD 4600 & HD 4800 cards; sorry about the mix-up):"HDMI output support : All display resolutions up to 1920x10802 Integrated HD audio controller with support for stereo and multi-channel (up to 7.1) audio formats, including AC-3, AAC, DTS, DTS-HD & Dolby True-HD4, enabling a plug-and-play audio solution over HDMI " Mind you, ATI's cards don't have an HDMI port - they use (gasp! shock!) a DVI-HDMI adapter. It's the third-party cards (MSI, Gigabyte, Asus, et. al) that have an HDMI port. You could see that, if you would go to the website of the very well-known online retailer.Since you just won't use my link, browse the frakking website yourself. Learn. Expand your knowledge pool.Otherwise, I might as well say that the far side of the moon can't possibly exist, because, well, I've never seen it.. :P-Chris [If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Well, I grit my teeth, summed up my nerve and visited www.newegg.com. So, I think I found a PowerColor HD 4850 that had an HDMI port. I couldn't find any cards manufactured by ATI at that site.I'm still not convinced about DVI-HDMI adapters piping audio through, and HD audio at that, since www.hdmi.org themselves say otherwise.There's still this issue of all those other CE devices and PC/Mac based devices ripping people off by claiming HD capability when they only support HD video resolution and not HD audio.I'll be posting another thread that places HDMI over HTTP/IPv6 in a broader context that involves VoIP, WiMAX, etc.

So (and, I do feel that I'm repeating myself here....), just because hdmi.org posted a blanket statement (which, IMHO, is there to cover their backsides) that "DVI-HDMI adapters can't transmit audio" means that no company is free to engineer their way around that 'problem?' ;)Back to that, search the Egg again:http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2010380048%201320945788%201305520549&name=ATIFirst card in the list:http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814127358That's an HD 4870-based card that has no HDMI port. However, it does come with a DVI-HDMI adapter, and can pipe HD audio thru it (since that is, after all, part of the video chip's feature set.)And, from it's product pageat MSI:HDMI 7.1 AUdio Output (optional)The ATI Radeon HD 4670 has a built in HDMI with HD audio support for one-plug HDTV connectivity. This unique feature is enabled with an intelligent DVI to HDMI adapter. The benefit of this approach is to preserve the traditional dual-DVI-I connectivity (with VGA support) that gamers demand while offering a seamless connection for big-screen HD gaming. No internal SPDIF or other audio cabling is required.Still say that it's not possible? :)Thank you, though, for "gritting your teeth" and visiting a legit website.And, you're right- no ATI-branded cards there. I think that ATI is getting out of the desktop-videocard market, and has chosen to go the route of chip manufacturer, instead (a la nVidia.)<There's still this issue of all those other CE devices and PC/Mac based devices ripping people off by claiming HD capability when they only support HD video resolution and not HD audio.>Examples?[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

There's no mention of any audio capability in DVI in the DVI spec.Take a look at this:http://www.ddwg.org/lib/dvi_10.pdfAs for examples of manufacturers of CE devices and PC/Mac based devices ripping people off - there are plenty of Blu-ray players with no HD audio support. Apple TV has no HD audio support. And there are plenty of PC video cards that claim HD capability, but have no HD audio support.

SPEnthusiast said:There's no mention of any audio capability in DVI in the DVI spec.Take a look at this:No sh!t. You don't say. A video-only interface, when it's built to the standard and only the standard, can't transmit audio?Um, when did I say that a standard, by-the-book DVI port could carry audio? I did not say that. ;)Anyways, I don't think that the spec sheet says that no one may deviate from it - at all - in even a way that willl not affect DVI functionality. SPEnthusiast said:As for examples of manufacturers of CE devices and PC/Mac based devices ripping people off - there are plenty of Blu-ray players with no HD audio support. Apple TV has no HD audio support. And there are plenty of PC video cards that claim HD capability, but have no HD audio support.Apple makes no claim that AppleTV does support HD audio. Actually, they say, quite plainly, what it does:Audio formats supportedAAC(16 to 320 Kbps); protected AAC (from iTunes Store); MP3 (16 to 320 Kbps); MP3 VBR; Apple Lossless; AIFF; WAV; Dolby Digital 5.1 surround sound pass-through(fromhttp://www.apple.com/appletv/specs.html)Got specific examples of BD players that don't have HD audio support, even though they claim to have it?Same with the videocards - specific examples, please."Has an HDMI port" does not automatically equal "manufacturer implies HD Audio support over HDMI." -Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Why would these video card manufacturers go to the trouble of deviating from the DVI standard, provide a non-standard adapter as well, all to pipe audio through DVI? Why can't they just provide an HDMI jack on their video cards that has native capability for HD audio? HDMI 1.3supports WQXGA (2560x1600).There are adapters that you can plug into HDMI jacks and that give you DVI jackson the other end, all conforming to standards. I think deviating from the standardcauses confusion in the marketplace, and reveals the truth about these video card manufacturers for not supporting HD audio natively in their products in the first place.Blu-ray is HD technology and HD implies HD audio in addition to HD video. I can't give you specific examples, as they can be used to track me. Or is that what you want? I don't wantyou getting that close to me.If a manufacturer provides an HDMI port in their products, they're implying that they support HD audio, and gullible consumers even unknowingly expect this capability. Instead consumers are taken advantage of by manufacturers of products like Apple TV and Microsoft XBox that provide an HDMI port, but no HD audio capability. This isexactly like robbing kids that can't tell, since theywouldn't even know that they've been robbed. Do women actually run Apple and Microsoft?

<<Why would these video card manufacturers go to the trouble of deviating from the DVI standard, provide a non-standard adapter as well, all to pipe audio through DVI? Why can't they just provide an HDMI jack on their video cards that has native capability for HD audio?>>Maybe because, for various hardware architecture reasons, they can't?And, they're not piping audio thru DVI - as you said, that's not possible. Rather, what they're doing is using the unused pins in the DVI socket to pipe audio into an HDMI adapter.A good many (IIRC, the vast majority) of the videocards that I showed you (at NewEgg) have two DVI outputs. Now, the last I looked, DVI was a lot more common on PC monitors than HDMI.Frankly, I think it's rather elegant- give the consumer two DVI outputs (so that s/he can connect two standard displays), and the option to connect a display via HDMI (and, depending on the video chipset, also having true HD audio output via that DVI-HDMI adapter.)The cards that do have a 'proper' HDMIport typically give you that in place of the second DVI output.<<I think deviating from the standardcauses confusion in the marketplace,>>People aren't completely stupid - they can read the manuals, the spec sheets, etc. Now, if they actually do, however, is something that no company or person has control over. Me, I actually like it when a company doesn't assume that I'm an illiterate idiot. :)<<If a manufacturer provides an HDMI port in their products, they're implying that they support HD audio, and gullible consumers even unknowingly expect this capability. Instead consumers are taken advantage of by manufacturers of products like Apple TV and Microsoft XBox that provide an HDMI port, but no HD audio capability.>>Again, Apple makes no claims that the AppleTV outputs HD audio. For that matter, MS doesn't claim that the 360 does, either.However, you'll have to pry that 360's HDMI output from my cold, dead hands - it's a HUGE improvement in picture quality over the component outputs.<<Blu-ray is HD technology and HD implies HD audio in addition to HD video. I can't give you specific examples, as they can be used to track me. Or is that what you want? I don't wantyou getting that close to me.>>Lose your tinfoil hat, did you?<<Do women actually run Apple and Microsoft?>>Wow. Just, wow.[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Well, instead of two DVI jacks, why can't they provide a DisplayPort jack? DisplayPort has been around for a while, and it and HDMI are the future. Obviously you don't know that there are a great many folks out there that don't know about these technologies, and would just buy something based on a requriement and rudimentary knowledge like "my PC needs a video card and it must do HD". When you're selling to someone like that, you better make da*n sure that you're giving them HD video AND HD audio capability. A lot of video card manufacturers don't take any of this into consideration, and they even pass the blame onto gullible salespeople.Apple claims HD capability for Apple TV, as well Microsoft for XBox, if only for fitting an HDMI jack on those products. They would be taking advantage of the kind of people I've talked about above, including those salespeople.Fortunately for me, I haven't made any deals with the Devilnor have Ipromised Him that I'll hook up with a woman. I never will, and I kind of feel sorry for the top brass at all these companies - Microsoft and Apple included - for slowly disappearing into the sunset without their fortunes.

<<Well, instead of two DVI jacks, why can't they provide a DisplayPort jack? DisplayPort has been around for a while, and it and HDMI are the future.>>That should happen, given some time. Only problem right now, is that there's a very small installed base of DisplayPort-equipped displays. There's what, 3, maybe 4 available? Last I checked, Apple was selling one, and Dell another 2 or 3. No one else.Give it time (like, probably another year or two.)<<Obviously you don't know that there are a great many folks out there that don't know about these technologies, and would just buy something based on a requriement and rudimentary knowledge like "my PC needs a video card and it must do HD".>>Au contraire. Rarely does a day go by, that I don't get a question along those lines from someone I know.<<When you're selling to someone like that, you better make da*n sure that you're giving them HD video AND HD audio capability. A lot of video card manufacturers don't take any of this into consideration, and they even pass the blame onto gullible salespeople.>>Um, every videocard's product page (and, paper-published specs) that I've ever seen are very clear in what the card does support. No specs say what it doesn't support, because, well, that would be silly and confusing. If it's not on the sheet, it doesn't do it. Period.As for the 'gullible salespeople': shame on them for not expanding their knowledge of what they're selling, and shame on their employers for not providing them the training that they need to do their jobs effectively.<<Apple claims HD capability for Apple TV>>Where? HD what? They don't claim HD audio (what you've been harping on for the last week) - they plainly say what they do support (see previous post.)<<as well Microsoft for XBox>>Again, no, they don't:Xbox 360 Elite supports HDMI 1.2 profile. For audio, you can select DD, DTS (at 1.5 Mbps), and WMA-Pro (Microsoft high fidelity multi-channel codec supported in some AVRs such as Pioneer). Since it is not based on 1.3, it will not support output of DD+ or TrueHD (even if it did, mixing would have been turned off).From http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=774635&page=108&pp=30; other sources can be found with a little more time.<<if only for fitting an HDMI jack on those products.>>For crying out loud, just because the HDMI spec allows for HD audio, doesn't mean that any manufacturer is implying (especially when they explicitly state otherwise) that their HDMI connection has HD audio support.<<They would be taking advantage of the kind of people I've talked about above,>>Question: how many people do you know that have a 7.1 kit? To be blunt, if a person has the cash to do that, they most likely either also have enough smarts to do a little research on the equipment that they buy for their setup, or they get professional advice. And, 'real professionals' (not BB aisle jockeys) do know their stuff.<<Fortunately for me, I haven't made any deals with the Devilnor have Ipromised Him that I'll hook up with a woman. I never will,>>On the former: good for you.On the latter: I (nor the few other people reading this thread, I think) don't care about your sexual proclivities. Whatever works for you, dude.(BTW: this has what to do with the topic???)-Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

Unlike you, there are quite a few of us that give equal, if not more importance to audio than video. I guess you'll are the kind of people that follow and spy on lifestyles of shallow Hollywood movie stars, so you only care about video. There are many of us that love music, so when a manufacturer says they support HDMI in their products, which supports HD audio, we expect HD audio capability as well in their products. And some of us don't have the time for very thorough research. We tend to trust companies like Apple and Microsoft, and you seem to be implying that they're not trustworthy.And I think HDMI over IPv6 is the future, along with probably DisplayPort over IPv6 - since DisplayPort does support 96+KHz, even 32-bit depth sample, 8-channelaudio according to:www.displayport.org

<<Unlike you, there are quite a few of us that give equal, if not more importance to audio than video.>>So do I (equal.)I gotta ask, though: you have a 7.1-channel kit to take full advantage of that HD audio? If not, then, what's the point?<<I guess you'll are the kind of people that follow and spy on lifestyles of shallow Hollywood movie stars...>>Quite the opposite. I can't stand that ____. I don't need to know what/where some actor/actress ate for dinner last night, or who they were sucking face with when they were at dinner.<<so when a manufacturer says they support HDMI in their products, which supports HD audio, we expect HD audio capability as well in their products>>Could you kindly quote & link just where, exactly, in the specs it says that HD audio is a requirement? I read it as that it's an optional extra - a way for a manufacturer to differentiate their products(or, in marketese, provide a value-added feature.)Side note:I also know quite a few people that don't know that HD audio even exists. So, how are those people negatively affected by a given product not supporting HD audio thru its HDMI port (be it the input or the output), when they think that the ceiling is at DD5.1, DTS max?<<And some of us don't have the time for very thorough research.>>I'm sorry.<<We tend to trust companies like Apple and Microsoft, and you seem to be implying that they're not trustworthy.>>I could say the same about you there, sir. How many times have you bashed Apple for not implementing HD Audio on the AppleTV? Are you also going to bash them for supporting less formats (on the AppleTV) than iTunes does, when the thing is made to (in addition to its net-streaming functionality) connect to an iTunes library?And, while I'm not an MS zealot/fanboi (nor an Apple basher) by any stretch of the imagination, I'm not saying that neither is "trustworthy." Um, where's MS figure into this discussion, anyways? :?<<And I think HDMI over IPv6 is the future, along with probably DisplayPort over IPv6..>>You do realize that all that IPv6 is, is a network-addressing & packet-switching protocol, right? And, that the primary reason for creating (to replace IPv4) it was increased address space?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]

I can see that you've fully grasped my vision, although you're being confrontational and argumentative at the same time. I won't be responding to any more of your posts.

<<I can see that you've fully grasped my vision, although you're being confrontational and argumentative at the same time.>>Well, sorry, but, I see it differently. I see me stating fact (and, with supporting documentation, as well as links to said documentation), and you stating theories (with no supporting documentation), 'implied facts', refusal to support your statements (I do recall you doing just that, thinking that I could somehow use that "to track your location"), refusal to take a look at my supporting links ("could have bad code in the link" was the justification that you stated), as well as random, off-topicstatements (I've quoted thouse already, don't see the need to do so again. However, if you'd like, I can go thru the thread and re-quote them.)Also, with the lone exception of the 'tinfoil hat' joke (which was in direct response to your "you might be able to track me, if I post a link to my supporting documentation" line), I've made no inference, much less direct statement, as to what kind of person you might be.This, however:<<I guess you'll are the kind of people that follow and spy on lifestyles of shallow Hollywood movie stars...>>is a blind-a** guess; and, some people (if they don't fall into that camp) might take offense to it. Myself, however, I just, plainly and without argument, refute it. Again, with fact.Oh, and one more fact for you, on the HD audio 'argument':"HDMI 1.3 was released June 22, 2006 and increased the single-link bandwidth to 340MHz (10.2Gbit/s).[13][14][104] It optionally supports Deep Color with 30-bit, 36-bit, and 48-bit xvYCC, sRGB, or YCbCr compared to 24-bit sRGB or YCbCr in previous HDMI versions. It optionally supports output of Dolby TrueHD andDTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers.[105]:fromhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-Definition_Multimedia_Interface(emphasis, in bold type, added)<<I won't be responding to any more of your posts.>>Tell you what - I'll make it a point to never again make a post in any otherthread that you start.Exceptions are: direct response to someone else's post in that thread.Deal?Good day to you, sir,Chris[If this post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" or "Helpful" button at the top of this message. By marking a post as Answered, or Helpful you help others find the answer faster.]