We are running Exchange 2003 (the '07 box is just about ready). Anyway, I have created multiple external contacts with external (SMTP) email addresses. If "TEST joeHOTMAIL" is an Outlook contact, and I send mail to "TEST joeHOTMAIL" the mail is sent out and joe receives it in Hotmail. However, if I send mail to a Distribution Group "TEST EXTERNAL CONTACS", where "TEST joeHOTMAIL" is a member, along with several other similarly defined external contacts, the message is returned as undeliverable and the following bounce back message is generated. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>B E G I N M E S S A G E Test External Contacs on mm/yy/2010 2:36 PM The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to find out the correct address. <MAILSERVER.DOMAIN.com #5.1.1> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<E N D M E S S A G E I know someone has the answer.... Thanks. -perry

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On Mon, 16 Aug 2010 23:09:39 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >We are running Exchange 2003 (the '07 box is just about ready). Anyway, I have created multiple external contacts with external (SMTP) email addresses. If "TEST joeHOTMAIL" is an Outlook contact, and I send mail to "TEST joeHOTMAIL" the mail is sent out and joe receives it in Hotmail. However, if I send mail to a Distribution Group "TEST EXTERNAL CONTACS", where "TEST joeHOTMAIL" is a member, along with several other similarly defined external contacts, the message is returned as undeliverable and the following bounce back message is generated. Are you asking about a Distribution Group in the Active Directory, or a distribution list in the Contacts folder of someone's mailbox? > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>B E G I N M E S S A G E > >Test External Contacs on mm/yy/2010 2:36 PM > >The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to find out the correct address. > ><MAILSERVER.DOMAIN.com #5.1.1> > ><<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<E N D M E S S A G E > >I know someone has the answer.... > >Thanks. > >-perry --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

The Distribution List I created is in Active Directory. I don't know if it matters, but each individual contact is hidden from the Exchange Address List. The Distribution lists were created and security placed whereby only those individuals who need to access to it can see its contents. The general Exchange users see the distribution list under ALL GROUPS, but cannot see the membership.

On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 15:55:34 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >The Distribution List I created is in Active Directory. > >I don't know if it matters, but each individual contact is hidden from the Exchange Address List. The Distribution lists were created and security placed whereby only those individuals who need to access to it can see its contents. The general Exchange users see the distribution list under ALL GROUPS, but cannot see the membership. If the mail-enabled Contacts are hidden from the GAL, how are you able to send an e-mail to "TEST joeHOTMAIL"???? The expansion of the distribution group is affected by the fact that the contact is hidden from the GAL. When you track the message you sent to the distribition group do you see the expansion event? Do you see the SMTP address for "TEST joeHOTMAIL" in the set of recipients after expansion? If you do, move to the SMTP protocol logs and find the RCPT TO command that contains the SMTP address for "TEST joeHOTMAIL". Was the status code returned by the receiving system a 250? If it was, the other system accepted the message for delivery. If you see a 5xx status returned by the other system the address was rejected by the other system and that just means you probably have the wrong address in the targetAddress property for the contact. Looking at your NDR, the address that was mentioned was "Test External Contacs". Is that the name of the distribution group? If you don't see a RCPT TO with the SMTP address in it then the problem lies in your system, but it's much better to verify that it's not something obvious before getting buried in troubleshooting. --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

All of the contacts created, about 50 in all, are hidden, except for my two external test recipients. Joe has two external emails for this. joeHOTMAIL was created as a contact, and joeYAHOO was created as a mail enabled user (account with external SMTP address). I unhid both for testing. I sent mail listing joeYAHOO and joeHOTMAIL as recipients and all was well. Once I put them into TEST External Contacs (my distribution group), I get the error.

On Wed, 18 Aug 2010 20:57:12 +0000, Rich Matheisen [MVP] wrote: [ snip ] >The expansion of the distribution group is affected by the fact that ACK! That SHOULD have said ". . . is NOT affected". --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

On Thu, 19 Aug 2010 16:53:11 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >All of the contacts created, about 50 in all, are hidden, except for my two external test recipients. Joe has two external emails for this. joeHOTMAIL was created as a contact, and joeYAHOO was created as a mail enabled user (account with external SMTP address). I unhid both for testing. I sent mail listing joeYAHOO and joeHOTMAIL as recipients and all was well. Once I put them into TEST External Contacs (my distribution group), I get the error. Okay. What about the message tracking and SMTP protocol logs? --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

Hi, What's the environment? Is it the multi-domain environment? What's the scope of that group? What's the SMTP address of the group? Thanks Allen

Ok, in both Outlook 2003 and 2007, I populate the TO field with "TEST External Contacs". I then go to its Properties and under E-mail Addresses tab, I see SMTP:TestExternalContacs@MYDOMAIN.com X400;c=us;a= ;p=First Organizati;o=Exchange;s=TestExternalContacs; We are in a single domain environment. The Group is of Global Scope Is there a limit on the number of characters for group names? I have another whose SMTP name is 59 characters long in all, but then TestExternal with domain name turns out to be 29 (and still not working).

On Fri, 20 Aug 2010 22:50:06 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >Ok, in both Outlook 2003 and 2007, I populate the TO field with "TEST External Contacs". I then go to its Properties and under E-mail Addresses tab, I see > >SMTP:TestExternalContacs@MYDOMAIN.com > >X400;c=us;a= ;p=First Organizati;o=Exchange;s=TestExternalContacs; > > > >We are in a single domain environment. The Group is of Global Scope > > > > > >Is there a limit on the number of characters for group names? Yes. But more importantly there's a limit on the number of characters in the part of the address to the left of the "@" symbol. IIRC, it's 64 characters. >I have another whose SMTP name is 59 characters long in all, but then TestExternal with domain name turns out to be 29 (and still not working). Why are you avoiding looking at the SMTP protocol logs? --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

I apologize for having not referred the logs, but I'll admit I'm not too familiar with the logging and I knew I was not going to be available for a brief period, and therefore was looking for the "quick fix", which never happened. Now, if I am looking in the right place, then there is nothing in the SMTP queues. I am in ESM, First Organization\Admin Groups\First Admin Group\Servers\MYSERVER\Queues. And under the "Number of Messages" columns, everything is Zero. This is recent (I tried to send to "Test External Contacs" before refreshing the screen.) Now I am looking at ESM\first Orgainization\Tools\Message Tracking. I found the failed test message I tried to send minutes ago and it says under the Event Header (Event Time is identical for all events): SMTP Store Driver: Message Submitted from Store SMTP: Message Submitted to Advanced Queuing SMTP: Started Message Submission to Advanced Queue SMTP: Message Submitted to Categorizer SMTP: Message Categorized and Queued for Routing SMTP: Non-Delivered Report (NDR) Generated I am looking in Windows\system32\logFiles\SMTPSVC1 at the file with today's date. Everything looks the same, then when I get to entries around the time I sent the earlier test I see the following: (Each entry shows time (omitted) and an IP address) - - 0 EHLO - 0 - - 0 HELO - 0 - - 0 MAIL - 0 - - 0 RCPT - 0 - - 0 DATA - 0 - - 0 - - 0 QUIT - 0 - - 0 (Entry 1 to this entry inclusive displays IP of smarthost #1) - - 0 (This entry to the end displays IP of smarthost #2) EHLO - 0 - - 0 HELO - 0 - - 0 MAIL - 0 - - 0 RCPT - 0 - - 0 - - 0 QUIT - 0 - - 0 HELO - 250 (Is this the next 'regular' entry?) Thank you.

On Tue, 31 Aug 2010 22:53:02 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >I apologize for having not referred the logs, but I'll admit I'm not too familiar with the logging and I knew I was not going to be available for a brief period, and therefore was looking for the "quick fix", which never happened. > > > >Now, if I am looking in the right place, then there is nothing in the SMTP queues. Not the delivery queues, the SMTP protocol log. On the property page of your SMTP Virtual Server, verigy that you have logging enabled. Then, on the "Advanced" tab of the logging dilog, check ALL the boxes to record the maximum amount of information. With that done. give it a few minutes and you should see log data being written. Now send a message to your DL and see if there's any RCPT TO commands for the SMTP addresses in question. >I am in ESM, First Organization\Admin Groups\First Admin Group\Servers\MYSERVER\Queues. And under the "Number of Messages" columns, everything is Zero. This is recent (I tried to send to "Test External Contacs" before refreshing the screen.) >Now I am looking at ESM\first Orgainization\Tools\Message Tracking. I found the failed test message I tried to send minutes ago and it says under the Event Header (Event Time is identical for all events): > >SMTP Store Driver: Message Submitted from Store > >SMTP: Message Submitted to Advanced Queuing > >SMTP: Started Message Submission to Advanced Queue > >SMTP: Message Submitted to Categorizer > >SMTP: Message Categorized and Queued for Routing > >SMTP: Non-Delivered Report (NDR) Generated Okay . . . so who got the NDR, and why? >I am looking in Windows\system32\logFiles\SMTPSVC1 at the file with today's date. Everything looks the same, then when I get to entries around the time I sent the earlier test I see the following: (Each entry shows time (omitted) and an IP address) You're not recording enough information for it to be more than a "yeah, it's doing *something*" check. See above and check ALL the boxes. --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

OK, I checked all the boxes and now there is more info in the logs. I created 3 emails, Numbers 1 and 3 being a test email to a friend, and Number 2 to "Test External Contacs". Then I clicked SEND in rapid fashion 3 times bang bang bang in order to sandwich number 2 in the logs (how would I know if another user is sending?) I extracted the log entries, removed the long date and time format, and added spaces between each entry. The name of my mail server here is FOOTBALL Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 DATA - - 0 0 4 0 78 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 354+Enter+mail,+end+with+"."+on+a+line+by+itself 0 0 48 0 78 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+Mail+accepted 0 0 17 0 78 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 RSET - - 0 0 4 0 110 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+Reset+Complete 0 0 18 0 110 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 MAIL - FROM:<ME@MYDOMAIN.com> 0 0 4 0 110 SMTP - - - - Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+<ME@MYDOMAIN.com>+...+OK 0 0 28 0 110 SMTP - - - - Thanks. perry

On Thu, 2 Sep 2010 17:56:18 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >OK, I checked all the boxes and now there is more info in the logs. I created 3 emails, Numbers 1 and 3 being a test email to a friend, and Number 2 to "Test External Contacs". Then I clicked SEND in rapid fashion 3 times bang bang bang in order to sandwich number 2 in the logs (how would I know if another user is sending?) I extracted the log entries, removed the long date and time format, and added spaces between each entry. The name of my mail server here is FOOTBALL There's only on RCPT TO command in there. But why would you have to send three messages? I thought your problem was that a message sent to a DL that had mail-enabled Contacts as members didn't result in the message being sent to the external Contacts? This just shows the DATA command starting, the message ending, and the receiving server accepting the message. Who the message was addressed to is a mystery. >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 DATA - - 0 0 4 0 78 SMTP - - - - >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 354+Enter+mail,+end+with+"."+on+a+line+by+itself 0 0 48 0 78 SMTP - - - - >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+Mail+accepted 0 0 17 0 78 SMTP - - - - >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 RSET - - 0 0 4 0 110 SMTP - - - - >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+Reset+Complete 0 0 18 0 110 SMTP - - - - This just shows the MAIL FROM command and, again, there's no RCPT TO commands. >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionCommand SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 MAIL - FROM:<ME@MYDOMAIN.com> 0 0 4 0 110 SMTP - - - - >Date/Time/SmarthostIP OutboundConnectionResponse SMTPSVC1 FOOTBALL - 25 - - 250+<ME@MYDOMAIN.com>+...+OK 0 0 28 0 110 SMTP - - - - --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

Since logging is for messages from ALL users, I used three messages so I could reference a starting and ending point in the logs in the event another user sent a message to say 20 people. The log information I posted is after my first message to my friend and immediately before the other message to my friend. Yes the true problem is that when I send with "Test External Contacs" in the "TO" box, I get a bounce back. if, after I populate the "TO" box with "test External Contacs", I right click and select "Expand DL" to the individual addresses, all goes well. If I am at my desktop PC, I could do this, but I have a rather large group of external contacts I want to list as a single Distribution Group for an executive using her Blackberry. >This just shows the MAIL FROM command and, again, there's no RCPT TO command. I checked all the boxes under the Advanced tab, so is my message even reaching this point? -perry

On Fri, 3 Sep 2010 17:44:30 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >Since logging is for messages from ALL users, I used three messages so I could reference a starting and ending point in the logs in the event another user sent a message to say 20 people. The log information I posted is after my first message to my friend and immediately before the other message to my friend. > >Yes the true problem is that when I send with "Test External Contacs" in the "TO" box, I get a bounce back. Then send the message to the "Test External Contacs" group. Then examine the SMTP log file and look for the "RCPT TO" commands that contain the SMTP addresses of those contacts. The status should be 250 for each of them if the receiving server accepts the RCPT TO command. If there's a 250 status then the problem (assuming you have the correct SMTP addresses in the Contacts) isn't on your side. If you get a 4xx or 5xx status there's usually descriptive text in the status message. But even if there isn't, you can see the IP address of the server that returns the 4xx or 5xx status. If that's not your server's IP address then the problem must be (again, assuming the SMTP addresses are correct) that the receiving server has some restiction on the number of recipients it allows in a songle message. >if, after I populate the "TO" box with "test External Contacs", I right click and select "Expand DL" to the individual addresses, all goes well. Once you expand the group, Outlook sends a single message to each recipient. If you send to the DL Exchange will send a single message addressed to several recipients if they're all in the same domain, or one message to each domain each of which may be addressed to one or more recipients. The behavior you're describing sure sounds like the "too many recipients" thing I noted above. [ snip ] >>This just shows the MAIL FROM command and, again, there's no RCPT TO command. > >I checked all the boxes under the Advanced tab, so is my message even reaching this point? It isn't that the log file contains insufficient information, it's that you extracted an incomplete set of rows from the file. A typical SMTP conversation would look something like this (just the commands sent, not the data in the commands or the status codes returned): EHLO MAIL FROM RCPT TO DATA or BDAT .. Without the RCPT TO, which is where your problem is, there's nothing to see! --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

I am troubleshooting this again. So far I've done two things. 1. Within System Manager, Logging is turned on (Message Tracking Center under Tools). I sent a message to my group "Test External Contacs" and get the Undeliverable bounce back message in my IN box. I tracked the message and get this detail: SMTP Store Driver: Message Submitted From Store SMTP: Message Submitted to Advanced Queuing SMTP: Started Message Submission to Advanced Queue SMTP: Message Submitted to Categorizer SMTP: Message Categorized and Queued for Routing SMTP: Non-Delivered Report (NDR) Generated 2. From System Manager, logging is enable for Default SMTP Virtual Server with all the boxes under the Advanced tab checked. Using Outlook, I sent a test message to my hotmail account (with my hotmail address typed in the TO field) and it has been received. I sent a second test message to my Test External Contacs group (my hotmail is part of this group as an SMTP-enabled mail user. No domain account.). Sending to Test External Contacs generates a bounce back. Now, when I go and look at the logs in \system32\logFiles\SMTPSVC1 and search I see my hotmail address clearly spelled out in the log but none of the other external accounts that are part of Test External Contacs. I'm assuming the mention of my hotmail account in the log is from the first message. It would appear to me then, my Test External Contacs is not making it this far, correct? Am I doing the logging correctly? thanks. -perry

On Sun, 26 Sep 2010 00:48:28 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >I am troubleshooting this again. So far I've done two things. > >1. Within System Manager, Logging is turned on (Message Tracking Center under Tools). I sent a message to my group "Test External Contacs" and get the Undeliverable bounce back message in my IN box. I tracked the message and get this detail: > >SMTP Store Driver: Message Submitted From Store >SMTP: Message Submitted to Advanced Queuing >SMTP: Started Message Submission to Advanced Queue >SMTP: Message Submitted to Categorizer >SMTP: Message Categorized and Queued for Routing >SMTP: Non-Delivered Report (NDR) Generated That's what you said before. I asked who got the NDR and what the reason was for the NDR. You never did say anything about either one of them. Knowing that would be more than a little helpful. >2. From System Manager, logging is enable for Default SMTP Virtual Server with all the boxes under the Advanced tab checked. Using Outlook, I sent a test message to my hotmail account (with my hotmail address typed in the TO field) and it has been received. I sent a second test message to my Test External Contacs group (my hotmail is part of this group as an SMTP-enabled mail user. No domain account.). Sending to Test External Contacs generates a bounce back. WHY? What's the rejection reason in the NDR? Post the whole thing. >Now, when I go and look at the logs in \system32\logFiles\SMTPSVC1 and search I see my hotmail address clearly spelled out in the log but none of the other external accounts that are part of Test External Contacs. I'm assuming the mention of my hotmail account in the log is from the first message. The time on the log file entry would correspond to the time you sent the message. Does it? >It would appear to me then, my Test External Contacs is not making it this far, correct? It looks that way. But just to emphasize how helpful it is, what's the NDR say??? > Am I doing the logging correctly? I sounds that way. --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

This is the bounce back message that comes to my IN box when I send to the group (would the NDR go elsewhere?) Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients. Subject: test 506PM Sent: 9/25/2010 5:06 PM The following recipient(s) could not be reached: Test External Contacs on 9/25/2010 5:06 PM The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to find out the correct address. <MYSERVER.MYDOMAIN.com #5.1.1> -perry

On Sun, 26 Sep 2010 19:59:53 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >This is the bounce back message that comes to my IN box when I send to the group (would the NDR go elsewhere?) > > > >Your message did not reach some or all of the intended recipients. > >Subject: test 506PM > >Sent: 9/25/2010 5:06 PM > >The following recipient(s) could not be reached: > >Test External Contacs on 9/25/2010 5:06 PM > >The e-mail account does not exist at the organization this message was sent to. Check the e-mail address, or contact the recipient directly to find out the correct address. > ><MYSERVER.MYDOMAIN.com #5.1.1> So the NDR is saying that the "Test External Contacs" doesn't exist? Try this: create a new e-mail and put "Test External Contacs" into the "To:" header. Now enter Ctrl+K. Is there a "+" to the left of the name? If you click that "+" to expand the group do you see the members you expect to see? --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

Yes the group expands and shows each individual contact (Same effect as right-click on the group and Expand DL). This issue I am trying to fix is for a company officer using a Blackberry. I do not know if expanding the list is available in Blackberry and I am quite sure the user in question would prefer to enter a group name only. Thanks. perry

On Tue, 28 Sep 2010 23:18:45 +0000, perry quon wrote: > > >Yes the group expands and shows each individual contact (Same effect as right-click on the group and Expand DL). > >This issue I am trying to fix is for a company officer using a Blackberry. I do not know if expanding the list is available in Blackberry and I am quite sure the user in question would prefer to enter a group name only. Wait . . . so this works properly when you use Outlook or OWA? --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP --- Rich Matheisen MCSE+I, Exchange MVP

Yes it works when I expand the DL using Outlook, but our exective has requested numerous distribution groups to be created. I do not believe there is a DL option on Blackberry.