Windows 10 Breaks Nearly All Armadillo/Software Passport Apps

I just wanted to make Microsoft aware, if you aren't already, that Windows 10 Technical Preview breaks nearly all applications that have been protected using Armadillo (also known more recently as 'Software Passport') from Silicon Realms. Armadillo/Software Passport is a software protection and licencing system, widely used by software publishers round the world.  Silicon Realms announced in 2014 that they were no longer selling or supporting Software Passport, so presumably they don't care. But there are a great many applications out there that will not run under Windows 10 (and won't install either), as things currently stand.

I have done some experiments with Windows 10 Technical Preview and have found that it is possible to protect a program using Armadillo/Software Passport, in a way that will work with Windows 10.  I don't want to go into the details here, but it can be done.  However, there are issues with the solution even for new products, and of course it doesn't solve the problem of all the existing programs, almost none of which are likely to be already using the 'fix'.  The concern is that if Microsoft don't solve this problem, there's an awful lot of software out there that won't run under Windows 10, that should.  And that's going to mean an awful lot of very unhappy customers.

By far the least painful solution, I would hope, would be to modify Windows 10 to restore full compatibility with Armadillo/Software Passport.

I would be very happy to help in any way I can, if anyone from Microsoft wants to contact me for more information about this.

February 6th, 2015 10:38am

And, it is important for you to ensure you have notified the publisher of this software about this so they can take appropriate action to get it working properly with Windows 10.  The publisher of the software must make changes to their software to ensure compatibility with Windows 10.

When Microsoft makes changes to the APIs causing incompatibility with existing third party, the third party software publisher has to make modifications to their software to resume compatibility.  Microsoft does not alter their APIs to accommodate third party applications unless it is a universal problem.

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February 6th, 2015 11:35am

I haven't notified Silicon Realms because - as I said - they have stopped selling or supporting the product.  It seems very unlikely that they are going to do anything about it.  And even if they were still selling the product, they could only affect future compatibility.  They couldn't do anything about all the existing products that are out there, that will now break under Windows 10.  Only Microsoft can.

"... unless it is a universal problem".  If by 'universal problem' you mean a problem that will affect a large number of products and a large number of people all over the globe, then yes it is a universal problem.  How many people are likely to be affected?  I don't know.  Probably even Silicon Realms won't know because they only sold the software.  All they know is how many clients they had - i.e. how many software publishers bought their product.  They won't know how many products those clients have produced and sold over the years.  Is it enough that Microsoft need to worry about it?  Probably yes.

February 6th, 2015 12:12pm

You must comprehend that Microsoft writes the operating system with the APIs.  When a new or updated operating systems cause incompatibility with any third party application the publisher of the application has to make the necessary changes to their product to be compatible with the updated operating system.  That is the way it has been since computers became readily available and operating systems were updated to incorporate new technology and such.

Microsoft is not going to make changes to their operating system or the APIs to accommodate one third party application.  And, if the publisher ceases support for the product then you need to find another third party application for your needs.  The probability of Microsoft making changes to Windows 10 to support an obsolete and unsupported application is extremely low.  The research, time, and man power to accomplish this would be cost prohibitive for just a single third party application.

This is the real world, not an ideal world!

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February 6th, 2015 12:42pm

I think Simon doing the right thing here.

MS are well known to go to rather extraordinary lengths to ensure
newer versions of Windows will run all popular Windows software
(baring security issues), so I think he's right to raise the issue
that he is.

Dave

February 6th, 2015 2:40pm

They will only if it is cost effective.  These things require resources:  Money, Time, and Manpower, none of which Microsoft is going to squander if there is no Return on Investment.  No company does!

My experience of over 20 years with these Pre-release edition operating systems is the third party software entity is the one that has to make the adjustments for the changes to be compatible with the newer operating systems.

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February 6th, 2015 6:12pm

I think Simon doing the right thing here.

MS are well known to go to rather extraordinary lengths to ensure
newer versions of Windows will run all popular Windows software
(baring security issues), so I think he's right to raise the issue
that he is.

Dave


Sounds like you need to apply for a position as a lead software engineer with Microsoft so you can ensure these types of discrepancies are avoided anytime Microsoft  embarks on any of their projects to improve Windows so you can ensure there are no incompatibilities with any existing third party software.  Microsoft is always eager to employ expert software engineers that can ensure their products are PERFECT!!!
February 8th, 2015 12:04am

Can you elaborate on what the issue is?  Is it related to Address Space Layout Randomization (ASLR)?
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March 31st, 2015 2:52pm

I have never, to my knowledge, come across a case where MS went out of their way to support a third party application that is itself unsupported as they progress with a new OS build. (Please do correct me with a specific example if I am wrong!) In fact I could count the number of instances where the have done this within an existing OS build on one hand, when there are much more resources available for such tweaking.

The correct solution in this case, especially given that the curve of modern computing inexorably bends towards virtualisation, is to run legacy applications (which *most definitely* includes this one) in a virtual environment that supports them. I would suggest you start thinking in this direction yourself, anything else is pure fantasy I'm afraid.




  • Edited by jaconsidine Tuesday, March 31, 2015 3:34 PM Grammar
March 31st, 2015 3:11pm

Hi bvj - I'm afraid I don't know what the issue is. The standard settings will cause an app to fail to run under Windows 10 Technical Preview.  By adjusting the normal settings you can get it to work, but the settings are only described in terms of the level of security they offer and not in terms of what they actually do.  There is a setting that explicitly mentions Address Space Layout Randomization (ASLR), but that it doesn't seem to make any difference.  That said, if Microsoft were to investigate, I'd guess that they would be able to work out where the problem lies fairly easily.

I'd like to also respond to those people who seem to think that it's nave to imagine that MS might even consider doing anything about this issue.  Yes they well may not do anything.  But it's not a question about altruism.  It's a question of self-interest.  If a significant percentage of all existing Windows programs will not run under Windows 10, this will make it a less attractive prospect to anyone thinking of upgrading.  So Microsoft have a calculation to do: (a) how many products are likely to be affected; (b) what would be the cost to them of solving the problem.  And if the answer to (a) is big enough, and the answer to (b) is small enough, of course they'll do it.  Wouldn't you?

jaconsidine said: "The correct solution in this case ... is to run legacy applications (which *most definitely* includes this one) in a virtual environment that supports them."

"This one"?  Did you read my post?  I'm not talking about one application.  I'm talking about ALL products that use Armadillo/Software Passport - which is likely to be all products produced by a significant number of software publishers around the world.  To the best of my knowledge, Armadillo/Software Passport has been the most popular commercially available software protection tool available.  Do you know what percentage of Windows applications use it?  No.  Neither do I.  So why are you dismissing the problem?

The suggestion about running the program in a virtual environment is not helpful.  Yes some users might be OK with that, but very few.  And you can't possibly sell new software to Windows 10 users on the basis that they need to run it under a virtual machine!

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April 6th, 2015 12:24pm

As indicated, the actual developer is needing to modify their app to function with the NEW os.  It is not really MS's responsibility to support software that is neither supported nor maintained by the developer.  Might be time to search for another application to protect your investment.

As for the dismissal of the "issue", I would imagine it is being dismissed since it is NOT a windows issue but rather an issue with a non supported nor maintained application.

MSs latest build has issues with it's own software, VS Developer (that I know of).  MS will modify this application as it is developed and maintained, maybe not earlier versions but new versions will accommodate the Windows OS changes.

April 6th, 2015 1:59pm

For the benefit of anyone who wants to know the outcome, Microsoft does appear to have fixed the problem.  I read on the Internet that the problem was fixed as of build 10041.  I have done most of my testing on build 10074 and can confirm that on that build at least, the problem does appear to have been fixed.  So thank you Microsoft!
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May 5th, 2015 4:11pm

>For the benefit of anyone who wants to know the outcome, Microsoft does appear to have fixed the problem.

That's good to know, thanks for following up Simon.

Dave

May 5th, 2015 6:13pm

Simon,thank you for sharing the problem with SoftwarePassport here!Thanks to Microsoft,that fix the problem and everything is fine now! I was also in deadlock and my only hope was the developers and engineers from Microsoft. I have not yet tested under Windows10, but I'm optimistic, as I read this thread.
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May 31st, 2015 1:03am

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